Category Archives: Avoiding Probate

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Photo of a house that was cut in half in order to be moved.

Does a Beneficiary Deed Avoid Probate in Arizona?

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In Arizona, the owner of a house can deed that house to someone using a Beneficiary Deed. The good thing about it is that it’s revocable and it can avoid probate. The applicable statute is A.R.S. Section 13-405. Sounds pretty slick, right? So the question is … does a Beneficiary Deed avoid probate in Arizona?

There are three main problems that I see with using a Beneficiary Deed:

  1. If you name more than one beneficiary, those beneficiaries may not get along. They are taking title as tenants in common, meaning that they each own an undivided interest in the property. But what if one of the beneficiaries moves into the property and refuses to cooperate in selling it or letting the other beneficiary have use of the property. Also, do you really foresee your kids (or whoever the beneficiaries) living in that property like a big commune, along with their kids and grandkids and spouses and friends. I’ve actually seen that happen and it’s kind of crazy. Usually the only way to force all of the beneficiaries to agree to move out and sell the property is to file a legal action in civil court known as a Partition by Sale. This is sometimes called a “Forced Sale.” The rest of the beneficiaries will almost certainly be successful in forcing a sale.
  2. The other problem I sometimes see if naming only one family members as the beneficiary, and assuming that person will sell the house and divvy up the proceeds among the rest of the family. I’ve seen this happen more than once. The way it often happens is something like this: Mom owns the house. Mom signs a will naming son as Personal Representative (executor). The will states that everything gets divided among three kids. Mom then records a Beneficiary Deed giving the house to the son. Son decides to keep the house and tells his siblings “tough luck.” Son wins because the law is on his side.
  3. Some people get confused and think the Beneficiary Deed is the same as a will. They keep it safe with their important documents but never record it with the County Recorder. If the owner dies before the deed gets recorded, it is no good.

The actual way that a “forced sale” works is that the attorney prepares a Complaint for Partition. The applicable statute talks about getting three commissioners to work together and have the property surveyed. The statute was written with farm land or vacant land in mind. Obviously you can’t survey and divide a house (like the photo above). The statute is a little vague about alternatives, but it allows some wiggle room. I usually ask for a neutral third party (such as a licensed fiduciary) to be appointed. The court will order that the neutral party be appointed as a “commissioner” in order to list the house for sale and divide the proceeds. If someone is living in the house, the “commissioner” can start an eviction proceeding to remove the tenant.

Does this all sound pretty complicated? Yup. So the moral of the story is to use a Beneficiary Deed only if you are absolutely 100% sure that you want the property only going to a single beneficiary, and you name that single beneficiary on the deed. Otherwise, stay away from them. There are too many risks. Besides, there are plenty of better ways of handling an estate plan. Don’t be stingy. Hire a good lawyer (such as us) to help you. The money and time that you save your family in the long run will far outweigh the cost up front.

Have a question about this? Drop me an email at [email protected] or give us a shout at 602-443-4888.


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Why Your Trust Needs a Trust Protector

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If you follow my blogs, you know by now that our law firm not only prepares Wills and Trusts. We also do probate litigation. This means that we go to court to handle messy family feuds over inheritances. One of the most common type of lawsuit has to do with a trustee who steals money, mismanages the investments, or for various reasons needs to be removed. A basic check and balance for a trust is to have a “Trust Protector” named who can remove an irresponsible trustee and appoint a successor. In this post, I will explain why your trust needs a Trust Protector.

That fact is that life is unpredictable. You have absolutely no guarantee that the people you named as trustee in your trust will actually do what you want. I have seen this too often. Let me give just a couple of real life examples.

Example One: Husband and wife sign a trust. They say that if husband dies, husband’s father and wife will be co-trustees. (This was a good idea at the time; it was one form of check and balance.) But, what wasn’t planned for? That husband and wife would get a divorce, husband would die shortly after that, and that the husband’s father would make off with all of the trust property, leaving the wife and kids impoverished. This could have easily been avoided if a Trust Protector had been named who could easily remove husband’s father as trustee and appoint a new truste.

Example Two: As mentioned by Jay Adkisson in a Forbes article from 2012, let’s assume that in your living trust you simply make one of your heirs/beneficiaries the Trustee. “The problem here is that you can’t predict the future. Maybe by the time you die the new Trustee has developed a drug problem, or maybe the Trustee harbored a grudge against one of the other heirs/beneficiaries and now wants them to get nothing (even though you wanted them to get their share). Without a Protector, the situation is bad. But with a Protector, the new Trustee can be fired.”

If your trust does not have a Trust Protector, I encourage you to amend it to include one. Personally, I prefer to have the protector have very broad powers, but also have a fiduciary duty. Thus, they are somewhat like a trustee, except that their powers are different from the trustee’s powers. The Trust Protector’s responsibility is to provide a check and balance to the trustee. The trustee is the active manage. The Trust Protector rarely gets involved except when needed to remove a trustee, modify the trust, or make other permissible changes.

This is not to be done by lay people. See a competent estate planning attorney.

P.S., if you are wondering what’s with the coat of arms and tartan, here’s my explanation. The Deloughery Coat of Arms shows horses, which are a symbol of loyalty. Also, there is a knight’s helmet. These are all symbols of protection and loyalty. These are good traits for a Trust Protector (and for a trustee, for that matter). The tartan in the background is the official Deloughery of Scottsdale tartan, duly registered in Scotland (which is where even Irish tartans need to be registered). I see a Trust Protector as being something like a knight … always on guard to protect the family fortune if necessary.


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Succession Planning for LLCs

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A business is like other types of property. If you die owning them in your personal name, there will need to be a probate. Don’t be like the young lady above, whose parents owned an LLC but failed to specify how the business would be managed when the parents died. Think about it. There might be payroll, bills, customers needing service. And no one is legally authorized to do anything. However, this is easily avoided. This blog will discuss two basic types of succession planning for LLCs.

In Arizona, there is a statute that covers “non-probate transfers.” As an example, if your house is in joint tenancy with your wife (or husband), then when you die, it goes to your spouse. The same thing happens with a checking account. If it’s jointly held, it goes to the joint owner.

You can do the same thing for a limited liability company (or for that matter, any other type of business). But it requires additional documentation that most people don’t do. For a limited liability company, we would rely on A.R.S. 14-6101 (“Nonprobate transfers on death; nontestamentary nature”). That statute basically says that an asset that is owned by the deceased person, and that is controlled by a written instrument, passes to a person the deceased person designates either in the written instrument or in a separate writing.

There are two basic ways to make sure a limited liability company is not tied up in probate after the owner dies. My preference is to have the LLC owned by a revocable trust. The revocable trust then says what happens to the property (including the company) after the owner dies. The second way is to name one or more beneficiaries of the member’s ownership interest in either a company document (such as a Member’s Operating Agreement) or (even simpler yet) on a separate writing like a Beneficiary Designation.

The quickest way to name a beneficiary of your LLC’s membership interest is by signing a form similar to this:

“Effective upon my death, I hereby assign all of my right, title, and interest in __________________, LLC to ______________________.”

Succession planning for LLCs can be tricky. It’s best to have an attorney do this for you because you want to make sure you are having the correct person sign it. I’m saying this because transferring assets can involve community property interests (if you are married) or other issues. If that’s the case, decide whether you want the spouse to sign a waiver of community property interest. It should also be acknowledged by a notary.

If you have any questions, feel free to give us a call at 602-443-4888.


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Should You Transfer Your Cemetery Plot to Your Trust?

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Should you transfer your cemetery plot to your trust? Yes, if you want to make sure that your wishes are carried out. In Arizona, the applicable law defines “cemetery property” that you would transfer to your trust as “a cemetery plot, including interment rights, mausoleum crypts, niches and burial spaces.”

If you have purchased such a cemetery plot or mausoleum niche (such as with a prepaid burial plan), the cemetery will give you a “Certificate of Ownership” for use of the plot. You don’t actually own the plot. There is no deed that gets recorded anywhere. Upon your death, the cemetery will contact the “next of kin” to determine what happens with your body. “Next of kin” generally means your spouse, then your kids (if you have any), or if you aren’t married and have no kids, then your parents or siblings.

But … what if your “next of kin” is someone who is irresponsible or who is estranged from you? Then what?

That would be a good reason to have a revocable living trust and to have the cemetery re-issue the Certificate of Ownership in the name of the trust. The cemetery will charge a small fee (perhaps $200) to re-issue the Certificate of Ownership. To get the ball rolling, I usually have my client sign an Assignment of the lot (or niche). I then fax or email that Assignment to the cemetery, along with the contact information for my client. The cemetery will contact the client to arrange for payment, and will then re-issue the Certificate of Ownership.

Here is the language for a sample Assignment:

Assignment of Personal Property

For value received I, [name of person] of [city and state], assign, transfer, and convey to:

[name of trustee], Trustee of the [name of trust] dated [date of trust], and any amendments thereto

The following described Interment, Entombment, Inurnment or Niche Right of Use:

[Description of the lot or niche, such as Section 6, Block 2, Lot 5, Space 3 Single] situated in [name of cemetery, and County and state of location], according to a map of said plot, Mausoleum or Columbarium filed in the office of the County Recorder of said County, and also in the office of said [name of cemetery], which map is hereby referred to and made a part hereof.

 

Dated:  ___________________                                                                                 [signature]

STATE OF ARIZONA                                              )

COUNTY OF MARICOPA                                      )  ss.

This instrument was acknowledged before me on [date], by [name].

[Seal]

                                                                                   

Notary Public

My commission expires:                                             

Once transferred to the trust, the trustee will be able to ensure that your body is properly disposed of according to your wishes. I suggest making sure that this does not conflict with any Health Care Power of Attorney or other document that gives a person the ability to decide what happens to your remains when you die. Avoid conflicts by having the same person in charge of this decision. (You don’t want your health care power of attorney and trustee fighting over what happens.)


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Business Owners Need Estate Plans

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Business owners need estate plans in order to ensure their businesses survive once they pass away. Here is why. Let’s say you own a successful business. It has lots of employees and ongoing business. There are contracts that need to be completed, and staff that needs to be paid. Then you die. You have a Will that names your spouse as the Personal Representative (executor). However, Wills need to be probated, and normally the soonest that can happen is one week from the date of death. Assuming there aren’t any hangups (such as the Will failing to waive bond), the surviving spouse can be appointed as Personal Representative right away.

But a week can be an eternity in the business world. Employment laws dictate that payroll needs to be paid within a certain time after the pay period ends. And what if there are employees in the field who need expenses covered?

Also, who is going to manage the business until it gets sold? Selling a business can’t be done in a matter of days. It takes time. Can your business last the months is normally takes to find a buyer and arrange a sale?

Here is the best way to plan ahead of time. The best way to plan ahead is to have a revocable trust that names a responsible (and business savvy) trustee to take over if you can no longer manage your business. Then make sure that your trust owns the business. If your business is an LLC, the member of the business needs to be the trust. (In other words, you will file Articles of Amendment for your LLC that replaces you as the member with, for example, “John Doe, Trustee of the ABC Trust, dated January 1, 2014.”) Make sure the trust language permits the trustee to manage an ongoing business, and that it permits the trustee to delegate the responsibility of managing the business to a replacement business manager.

NOTE: The word “manager” is used in two different ways here, and it can be confusing. The “manager” of an LLC is the person listed with the Secretary of State as the person in charge of the LLC. However, in terms of managing a business, that may be completely different people. I normally assist clients in this regard by having the LLC Manager (the person named as the official manager on the Articles of Organization) sign a Resolution naming one or more assistant managers. These assistant managers are the people who are actually on the ground running the business: making sure that paychecks get signed, continuing marketing efforts, meeting with clients, etc.

You can read more on this topic at an enterprise.com article here.

Have you heard of situations in which the business owner died and the business struggled as a result? Do you have any insights? Please share below.


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Resolving Disputes Involving Guardianships and Conservatorships

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Resolving Disputes Involving Guardianships and ConservatorshipsDisputes involving guardianships and conservatorships can be confusing and overwhelming for most people. The single biggest mistake I see in this area is people not consulting a probate litigation attorney. An experienced attorney will not only be familiar with the applicable statutes and case law, but will also know the applicable probate rules. Here is what you need to know about resolving disputes involving guardianships and conservatorships.

Guardianships and conservatorships is one of those areas of law that the uninitiated simply cannot tackle alone. People serving as guardians or conservators find themselves in a position where they are expected to be an expert on a complex topic they likely know little about. This is fertile ground for anger, surprises, greed and revenge among heirs and family members. While some guardianship and conservatorship matters are settled peacefully and amicably among family members and heirs, many times the actions by the guardian or conservator can engender disputes and bad feelings.

I recently worked with a prominent family in the Phoenix area to help the adult children resolve a dispute about their mother’s money. It turned out that one sister who had been named trustee and financial (general) power of attorney was mismanaging funds. To rectify this, I helped the other siblings file for conservatorship. We were able to obtain copies of all the financial documents and track all the funds that had been held in the mother’s trust and LLC.

After examining the financial documents, we could then force the sister who had been serving as trustee and financial power of attorney to pay back the money she’d stolen from the trust and business. We then replaced her with a professional trustee. (My clients became co-conservators.) We resolved this dispute in a cost-effective and family-oriented manner while maintaining the family’s privacy, thus avoiding public drama that would have tarnished the family name and reputation.

Conservators and guardians make important decisions on behalf of a loved one. But if the conservator or guardian is not living up to the responsibilities of the position you do have options. A probate litigation attorney can help you assess your unique situation and give you direction.

If you are an heir or if you’re serving as a guardian or conservator and you’ve found yourself in a dispute, don’t wait and hope the problem will go away on its own. Enlist the help of a probate litigation attorney right away.

In our next post we will look at solving disputes that involve trusts. If you have questions about guardianships and conservatorships, or other probate issues, please comment below or contact our office.

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What’s a Probate Emergency?

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What's a Probate EmergencyThings can get out of hand, even under the best circumstances, when caring for a loved one or settling an estate.

Probate court helps families arrange care for loved ones who are aging or incapacitated. After a loved one passes away, probate court helps a family sort through and settle their affairs.

It generally takes many months, sometimes more, to settle a case, depending on where you live and the complexity of your situation. Sometimes, however, families need immediate action from the court.

Here are a few examples of emergency probate situations that could require immediate legal intervention from probate court.
• If an elderly person is on the point of being evicted because bills haven’t been paid. A judge can appoint a temporary conservator to help resolve the situation until a permanent conservator can be appointed.

• If a person is not receiving necessary medical treatment for a life-threatening condition. The court can be petitioned to appoint a temporary conservatory.

• If assets are being stolen from the estate or trust of someone who has passed away, a judge can appoint a special administrator or special trustee.

Although some people feel that the police should be called in to resolve an emergency probate situation, the police have no jurisdiction in civil matters involving a guardianship, conservatorship, trust dispute or a decedent’s estate.

What people can do is provide evidence showing a high likelihood of imminent harm or danger unless the court acts immediately. For example, in a situation involving guardianships or conservatorships, you must present the judge with a physician’s note that clearly states, “An immediate guardianship is necessary.”

It’s essential to provide sufficient evidence to prevent a dismissal of any petition. This is where it’s important to have an attorney working with you. Most people who try to represent themselves to establish an emergency situation don’t know enough about the complexities of probate law to provide the judge or commissioner sufficient supporting information.

Here are a few of the other common mistakes people make in probate emergencies:

• Doing nothing after being told by the police the probate emergency is a civil matter.

• Taking away an elderly parent without letting anyone else know, to prevent the parent being placed into a nursing home you didn’t approve of. This can be considered a criminal action.

• Securing valuables from the decedent’s estate to protect them

A probate emergency situation arises when there is immediate danger, immediate harm to either a person, to property or the trust. You must be able to prove to the court that your situation requires immediate action. A lawyer can help with this to ensure the time response that is critical to helping you receive the assistance you need. You don’t have to navigate the waters of probate alone. We can help.

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Estate Planning Basics: Trust Assets and Probate Assets

Estate Planning Basics Trust Assets and Probate AssetsEstate planning isn’t just for the wealthy. It’s an important element of protecting the people you love and the legacy you want to leave behind. An estate is made up of assets.

Assets can be any form of cash, physical property or intangible benefits. These include:

•  A house
•  other real estate
•  business interests
•  stocks, bonds, and mutual funds
•  money-market accounts
•  brokerage accounts
•  royalty contracts, patents, and copyrights
•  jewelry and antiques
•  precious metals
•  works of art
•  valuable collections

For estate-planning purposes, assets fall into two main categories: trust assets and probate assets. Assets held within a trust [link to post on trusts] are referred to as trust assets. Assets that are not within the trust are called probate assets. I’d like to outline the two, and show why creating trust assets is preferable in estate planning.

Trust assets

The advantage of putting assets into a trust include reduced estate taxes and greater control in how your descendants will receive their inheritance. When you put your assets into a trust, you no longer own the assets legally, which become known as trust assets.

You can decide what you’d like to be put into a trust, to become a trust asset, and you do this by having the item or property or deed officially given to the trust, with a title in the form of a deed or other legal documentation. For example, a certificate of title for a car owned by a trust should show John Doe, Trustee, or something similar indicates that it’s the trust that owns the asset, and not John Doe himself. There are various ways to transfer property such as jewelry, art, coins and other collectables, and an estate planning attorney can assist with this.

Probate assets

All assets that are not included in the trust are probate assets. A court proceeding is necessary to determine how these probate assets can be distributed. Thus, it makes sense to consider assigning assets to a trust, to avoid having your heirs go through probate court to receive any legacies you have assigned them.

The actual act of transferring assets to a trust can be a bit complicated and challenging, even for an attorney who has some experience with this process. But it’s worth the time to work with an experienced estate attorney to set up a trust for assets so that your estate can run smoothly.

Get help from someone who is skilled in estate planning and probate. It’s critical that you have legal documentation that the trust owns the assets. Without such documentation, these assets cannot be distributed as part of the trust and, as I mentioned, they’re considered probate assets.

The consequences of a poorly planned estate can affect not only the peace of mind of your survivors, but can be detrimental to the value and distribution of the assets you leave behind.

Find an experienced attorney who is familiar with probate law and asset protection in your state to protect your family and protect your legacy. [link to service line questionnaire]

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Estate Planning: What Is a Trust?

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Estate Planning What Is a TrustA trust is similar to a will. It’s an elegant way of specifying how your property gets distributed upon your death. Property placed in a trust can pass to your designated beneficiaries without the delays and expense of going to probate court.

But – a big but – a living trust is not a complete substitute for a will. You won’t be able to name a guardian for a minor child, for example. For many people a trust is a more efficient way to transfer property at death, especially large-ticket items such as a house. Here are a few benefits of placing your property in a trust:

  1. You can avoid probate. This allows you to bypass probate and to pass the property directly to your designated beneficiaries. This is especially important if you own real property in multiple states.
  2. A trust can help with property management for those who can’t or do not want to manage for themselves. (This is particularly beneficial for older individuals who want to make sure they will be cared for without the need for guardianship or conservatorship.)
  3. Trusts can reduce estate and gift taxes.
  4. A trust protects assets from creditors and lawsuits better than does a will.
  5. If you want to protect family wealth for future generations, you can set up a trust to protect these assets (whether a business or other accumulated assets). You can also save estate taxes (if this is relevant). A trust can also protect these assets from irresponsible heirs over several generations.

There are a variety of types of trusts. They are both flexible and complex. One of the most common types of trusts is called an AB trust, also called a bypass trust. An AB trust helps provide significant estate-tax savings as well as preserve assets to survive the blending of families when and if spouses get remarried. You need three things to create a trust for your estate:

  1. The creator, also called settlor or grantor
  2. Trust property
  3. Beneficiaries

You don’t need to name someone to manage your trust (though this is certainly a good idea). The court can always choose someone to administer the trust. You can have a trust as long as you have someone who created the trust, you have property in the trust and some identifiable beneficiaries.

Think of a trust as a special place where ordinary property from your estate goes, as the result of some type of transformation that occurs, that takes on a new identity with immunity from estate taxes and resistance to probate. In this article, I primarily discussed “living trusts” or revocable trusts. You can read more about this type of legal instrument here.

I’d love to hear from you. If you have any questions please give us a call or leave a comment below.

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When to Get Help from an Arizona Probate Attorney

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When to Get Help with ProbateDo-it-yourself projects can range from remodeling your home to engineering homebrew biodiesel to fixing your car to building worm-composting systems. But just because you can do something yourself, doesn’t necessarily mean you should. If you are named as a Personal Representative or trustee, and some of the property is in Arizona, you need to hire an experienced Arizona probate attorney.

That means, especially, something as important as probate.

Managing and settling an estate is one thing that may not be well-suited to doing it on your own. In some cases, settling an estate can be done without the assistance of an attorney. But in most situations, settling an estate can be quite complex and difficult to navigate on your own. If you make mistakes as a personal representative, you may pay more in penalties than you would pay for an attorney to help execute the will.

The two most common mistakes probate DIYers make when managing an estate are these: The failure to maintain adequate documentation, and the failure to pay taxes or creditors before distributing assets.

Unfortunately, it’s easier to make mistakes than to avoid them. Probate is a technical area of law that varies for each unique situation.

In most cases, you can’t really do it by scanning the Internet. Here are 10 tricky areas of settling an estate that an attorney can help you navigate:

  1. Dealing with creditors
  2. Sending the proper documents to interested parties
  3. Making sure the proper forms are filed with the court
  4. Locating and interpreting your estate planning documents
  5. Making sure you know how to properly protect the deceased person’s
    property
  6. Creating an accurate inventory of probate assets 
  7. Adequately informing necessary parties about a person’s death: bankers, insurance companies, the Social Security Administration.
  8. Discussing the division of assets with the heirs
  9. Keeping adequate records, especially if you’re being reimbursed for your
    time serving as personal representative
  10. Making sure tax forms get filed properly

Most people have minimal knowledge of the technical legal aspects involved in
settling an estate. What may seem to be just a simple mistake could actually result in fines, lawsuits and a lot unnecessary struggle and grief during an already stressful time.

If you are serving as a personal representative, it is your duty to make sure the estate is handled correctly. You don’t have to do it yourself. Seeking qualified help is the best way from protecting yourself from mistakes and their consequences.

If you have questions about whether you need an attorney to help you settle an estate, we can help. Comment below or contact our office.

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Probate Basics: 5 Things You Should Know About Probate

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Managing a loved one’s estate that’s gone into probate can be overwhelming and more than a bit confusing. But it doesn’t have to be. Here are some probate basics that can help you start to understand this process.

With proper estate planning, you can avoid a lot of the drama often associated with legal proceedings.

Most people don’t know how to properly plan their estates or the granting of their final wishes – so remaining family members are left to sort through an often-confusing mess. But if you understand what probate is – and how it benefits you – you can take the first step to avoiding drama and confusion.

5 Things You Should Know About ProbateLG

What is probate law?

Technical definition: Probate is a court-supervised process where a will or a trust is established to be the decedent’s valid will. It concerns validity.

But probate also applies to instances where someone is incapacitated, or when there’s a trust that’s been established (and there is a dispute that needs to be resolved). In general, probate refers to any court proceedings that deal with the deceased or incapacitated person’s affairs. (Probate court does not apply to murder, malpractice or other wrongful death cases.)

Translation: Probate is the first step in the legal process after someone dies, or if a living person is unable to make further decisions about his or her estate. The parties involved in settling the estate will go to probate court where a judge (no jury) will review the case and help straighten things out to settle the affairs of the deceased or incapacitated person.

Probate court accomplishes five basic things:

  1. Proves that the deceased or otherwise incapacitated person’s will is valid (this is usually straightforward)
  2. Appoints a person to be in charge of gathering and inventorying assets, paying debts, and distributing the assets
  3. Pays any outstanding debts and taxes
  4. Resolves various disputes that can arise, such as who gets what personal property or how much the house should be sold for
  5. Distributes the remaining property as the will directs (or under state law if there’s no will).

Benefits of Probate

Probate sometimes gets a bad rap. It’s expensive, it’s scary, it’s overwhelming: These are just a few complaints I hear often. There are regulations in place, however, to protect you. Lawyers can charge only what’s considered a reasonable amount for their service in probate.

Here are a few of the benefits of probate that make it a worthwhile proceeding.

  1. Probate gives you options. You can have a say in making sure things are taken care of correctly, according to directions given in the deceased persons’ will.
  2. Probate gives heirs and beneficiaries a voice. Probate gives you recourse should you need help as a beneficiary and heir to make sure the will is carried out properly.
  3. Probate provides perspective. In probate you get the benefit of having multiple people look at issues from various angles, which makes it more likely that you will find a decision that everyone will agree on.

For the most part, probate is a relatively quick and easy way to work out these details. Most cases get resolved within a few months.

To sum up, probate is a court that you can go to whenever someone either dies or becomes incapacitated. It’s a way of not only resolving issues that come up, but also of preventing issues both for the protection of the person in charge and for the other heirs involved.

Do you have any questions about probate? I’d love to help. Leave a comment below or give our office a call.

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